並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-4-%E5%AF%8C%E9%82%A6%E7%9A%84%E5%B0%91%E4%B8%BB%E9%A0%98%E9%9A%8A-vs-%E7%B6%B2%E5%8F%8B%E4%B8%80%E5%A0%86%E6%80%AA%E5%95%8F%E9%A1%8C-ft-%E8%94%A1%E6%89%BF%E5%84%92chris-%E4%B8%8A/id1593381821?i=1000541888406